Hasegawa Mercedes C9

Greg Baker
ooohhhh...baby!

Kerry COX
The seam lines are the one thing that made the difference between the Tamiya kit and the Hasegawa kit like chalk and cheese. 🙁
But Peter will of course, make a silk purse out of a sows ear. 🙂
Once the gloss coat goes on, the magic will happen.

Peter Hardy
Very eloquently put KC. A rough nut like me would tend to say I am going to attempt to turn pig shit into strawberry jam. I will paint the body first, there is precious little else in the kit! I have put a coat of primer on everything still on the sprues, rather than take all the parts off first. It'll mean that I will prime everything twice but extraordinarily times call for extraordinary measures! It is a challenge but one I am up for.

JD, if you get the foundations right the rest should flow. This is a very simple kit with problems that need a simple fix. Sure, there is some work involved but I am looking forward to the best paint job I have ever done! Should be interesting, I have bought some Zero Paint to do the job. Never used it before but I have been warned that it is a "hot" paint and care is needed. Wish me luck!

Peter Hardy
Motivational speech John!

Martin Oostrom
It's looking good buddy. I quote Bob Ross: We don't have mistakes, only happy accidents.

Kerry COX
The anti climax stage and all the best to come. 😉 👍

Greg Baker
Oh, it's looking good!

Peter Hardy
It's not looking good anymore! Had a chemical reaction between the paint and the plastic. Kit is cactus.

Lode Schildermans
Peter, I'm curious what went wrong here. I hope you get the answers looking for. Pity, it started so promising

Martin Oostrom
That's a big bummer Peter. It looked so promising

Peter Hardy
Yeah, I read and did what the website instructs, however it is quite possible the plastic may have degraded so I am not prepared to blame Zero. I have sent them a message so I will wait and see if they have an answer.

wilky
I'm no expert but I reckon it's a reaction between the paint and the primer

Slavo Hazucha
😮 Paint & primer must have blended into Some kind of alien blood... It's one of these things you would never achieve if you wanted it - sorry for your loss, I really like the C9, just been racing it with my boy in Gran Tourismo...

Peter Hardy
Well, the paint has certainly got through the primer. And I will certainly replace the kit with the Tamiya version which KC tells me is excellent! I have yet to talk to Paul at UMP about it but I doubt it is the primer. I use it all the time and have had no problems at all. In fact I love the stuff. Zero paint is popular in GB too so it has to be something I have done.

bossy122
I had the same exact thing happen on a Jordan 191. I wonder, do you live in an arid desert?

Chaz Gordon
They are using Toluene as a Thinner in the paint, Which according to Wikipedia can also be used as a Cement in Fine Polystyrene Kits!
It seems they are basically using automotive paint formulations similar to Celulose, which used to go on models back in the day, but the primer acted as a barrier coat, being much less "solventy". Now of course, all Automotive rattle can paints are Acrylic based.

At a guess, I'd say their paint is only safe if the model is first entirely encased in their own Primer. It's probably fine with the hard plastic the likes of Revell use, but I'd bet an Eduard kit would end up as a blob of goop on the floor in a few minutes.

BTW, Bummer about the kit, it was looking promising. You never know if you contact Zero they might sort something out for you, I'd expect they would like to know what circumstances resulted in their Model paint melting a model.

Tom ...
Wow, that is brutal! So sorry Peter. You must be bummed! Good education for us though! Sheesh!

Alexander Grivonev
Woooow m8....what have you done 😄

In all honesty, Zero Pains filler on raw plastic did this?

The Zero Paints product range are actually automotive products, they definitely should be handled with some care and are more aggressive than you regular "hobby paint". I always go with Tamiya Spray can filler, wonderful, wonderful stuff. Painted my yellow Lambo this way, Tamiya filler + yellow automotive paint by Lechler (which is the brand Zero Paints uses I believe) no problems.

Patrick Hagelstein
Wow Peter! 😮 I used Zero Paints only once in testing a vibrant orange for an F-4F jet. I ordered their primer as well, as I read on multiple car forums how hot that paint is. I used the primer and the paint and it came out meh-ish.... The car guys say that Zero is designed to be pebbly and that their gloss makes it pop and can be buffed to a high shine. Nothing for an aircraft kit with lots of bumps and panel lines.... I switched to Gravity (the Spanish one!) and had great results: smooth, thin, vibrant and most of all, safe to the plastic! 👍

Peter Hardy
Not bummed too much Tom, it's a very ordinary kit and KC has found another body for me.
I guess it's an education for all of us so it isn't a total loss. I have spoken with UMP who have advised me that Zero is fine if it goes on in ultra fine coats which I did two of, not ten. It does give a flat finish which requires a clear gloss, Zero advise their own 2k. They have a tutorial on their website but who the hell reads a tutorial or even looks for one with a different brand of paint?
Pat, I had a pebbly finish after two coats and started to apply a slightly wetter coat to get rid of the pebbles! I have more Zero here for a couple of specific builds coming up next year. I am looking at this as a challenge rather than a return to what I have always done. Kez is sending me some Tamiya enamel which he has had great success with and wants me to try. Gravity Spain is building a great reputation with their lacquers. We have SMS in Oz which also make a fantastic range of 400 colours now, I have had many comments on a couple of models where I have used their lacquer and an Alclad clear gloss.
Alex, what doesn't kill you makes you stronger. I haven't finished with Zero, I am a dog with a bone!
Chaz, thanks for all that info! Information is power and this has made all of us a little more so!

Tom ...
Yes, "dog with a bone" is the secret to success! You are setting a great example for the rest of us. 👍

bossy122
Chaz' comment about hard and soft plastic is interesting. When this happened to me, I took this PlayStation controller that somehow broke into pieces, I painted it under the exact same conditions as I did the 191 and the paint went on just fine on that. On a different forum, the opinion was that my air pressure was too high. I couldn't adjust the pressure on my prehistoric compressor, so I couldn't really test that theory.

Peter Hardy
Definitely not air pressure. Chemical reaction certainly. Cheap kit and not an expensive lesson. A challenge in fact!

bossy122
Wish I was as positive about challenges. Have you thought of stripping that one?

Kerry COX
Yeah. 50 and 60 bucks a go. ! real cheap.

Chaz Gordon
Are there any documented Merc C9s that caught fire? You have the makings of a dio there?

Kerry COX
Blistering race pace you mean. ? hahahahaha 👍

Rui S
Sorry to see your good and challange project go down… (I agree With Chaz)...in flames. .
Just thougt the same, when I saw this result. A crashed burned car Dio, Mate 👍
For sure it wasn´t the expected "I am looking forward to the best paint job I have ever done!" quite ironic and reverse result. Sad and very bad luck. So the dio should also be a great challange to turn the tide.

Greg Baker
Oh, yeah! That gets my vote too! Creating destruction is a tricky business, but the result will be amazing and unique.

Peter Hardy
I won't throw away the body, you guys are giving me evil thoughts again! I don't know about burning but Mark Webber tried to do a triple backflip on the back straight at Le Mans at 300kph twice one year! Thing went about 12 metres in the air! Some food for thought there! Kerry has very kindly bought me a replacement kit which I will paint with Tamiya enamels also at his expense. He is determined to make me a halfway decent modeller yet! Think he will get a very nice Xmas present from me this year!

Chaz Gordon
Bossy, it's possible the ps controller is abs plastic, which is quite common for that sort of Application, being very tollerant of being thrown across rooms by teenagers. It's also common on vehicle trim, so an automotive paint that eats it would not be popular

Spanjaard
wow, never seen plastic behaving like this... i have seeing falling apart in pieces in my NXR, but this one is even worse.... yes, the burning dio is a very interesting idea. of the car left in a desert to rot for 20 years after its years of glory... good to test new skills 🙂
pity that it happened, but i am sure you will do something good out of it

bossy122
Chaz, you should see what a 30 yr old can do to a PS controller when properly motivated😉

Peter Hardy
Re-started!

Slavo Hazucha
Back in the fight!😉 👍

Spanjaard
well done Peter 🙂 time for making a shiny car 🙂

Peter Hardy
All mould lines removed, all flash removed, all ready for primer! Maybe tomorrow if I can sneak out of the home office for half an hour.

Rui S
Cross your fingers, Mate😉

Chaz Gordon
Not easy to get those ceramic blades here. Time to trawl the web.

Patrick Hagelstein
Yeah, home offices are the worst when it comes to clocking in and out... 🙁

Tom ...
It's like something out of a horror movie!

Alexander Grivonev
Hey Pete, it's HasegAwa not HasegOwa. It bugs me everytime I see your thread 😄

..Unless it is some Aussie slang to confuse us north-hemispherians

Peter Hardy
No Alex not Aussie slang. I just don't spell Japanese real good. I will fix it. PS. Your attention to detail is annoying, stop it! 😉

wilky
It's been bugging the shit out of me but I didn't want to point it out because there's lots of spelling mistakes on Scalemates

Hugo Oliveira
Gosh, what a nightmare. Fortunately never happened to me. Good luck on that one mate, I´m sure in the end it will compensate all the effort.

Spanjaard
too many non native speakers wilky 😛 . myself, guilty as charged

Alexander Grivonev
and too many grammar n@zis 😄 (guilty as charged)

Rui S
@Spanjaard, non native from where? Belgium?😉😄
This is a International forum isn't it? So…
I personly don't see where are the anoying bugging spelling mistakes issues. 🤔 or should i say Cuál es el problema?

Kerry COX
I wuz gunna say something in the Oz vanacular, but it is full of spelling mistekes so I won't. 😉
Escept to say...........:-/

Rui S
😄 😄 😄

wilky
Nobody that uses English as a second language needs to apologise for spelling errors.
I can only speak one language so I can't point the finger at anyone here.
Also it's not about the spelling.
We're not in School

Greg Baker
저도 그렇게 생각해요...

Peter Hardy
Greg, thank you for your contribution. I think?

Chaz Gordon
Alexander, They have a whole social media platform specifically designed for Grammar N@zis. Unlimited posts just waiting to be corrected.😉

Chaz Gordon
As for the spelling, There is a how to series on Amazon Prime, where the presenter refers to them as HasaWaga. I think there is a lot of disagreement on pronunciation of Brands. I take the approach that I will consider the speech patterns of the country of origin and try to work out how they would say it. For instance, in a Japanese speakers manner, I would expect Tamiya would be more like Taam...Yah!

Rui S
😄😄😄 well said Chaz HAHAHA

Peter Hardy
Hey Rui, Takom have just released an armoured Willy's Jeep. Buy it please? I would LOVE to see you build it!

Rui S
Hi Peter, I think i saw the nice box art here, but I´ve already built 2 Tamiya willy's when i was a kid, and I redeemed one already in my album Tunis

Tunís | Album by mig (1:35)

and album Tunís - Panzer III N - 251/1

Tunís - Panzer III N - 251/1 | Album by mig (1:35)

The other is base coated and waiting…
Also I stoped enlarging my big stash, two years ago. So the investement now his on building tools or material.
But anyway thank you very much for the challange 😉 👍

Urban Gardini
I'm only irritated by spelling mistakes that is my own. I do them from time to time but most of 'em is due to my keyboard not always register all hits on it's dyslectic keyboard. Besides English is my second language...

Chaz Gordon
There's only one country in the world where "English" is a first language, everyone else ruins it. with their made up words and missed letters,

Spanjaard
if i would have got a cent for every spelling/grammar mistake i have made in this site alone, i think I could have retired and dedicate my time to modelling 😄 😄
@Rui, native from much closer to you than Belgium, 150km from Mirando de Douro😉

Rui S
@Spanjaard, Yes I knew you are in Spain, but I was refering to Tim and this site birthplace😉
@Peter, you better start painting the kit, otherwise this thread is taken over by other issue. Sorry😉 😄

Spanjaard
i am not in Spain😉

Urban Gardini
The most effective way to spot the spelling mistakes you do is when you press the Add comment button...

Rui S
@Spanjaard, France is more than 150km from Miranda. Valladolid?

wilky
I think it's great to see the expansion of people's personalities here beyond just saying how nice a project is.
We are all here because of a common interest but we are all more than kit builders and it's not like the rest of the internet where we're calling each other names and shit.
Well when Bob's not around

wilky
Well I'm more than a kit builder.
I guess some people only have one hobby.
I have six hobbies

Urban Gardini
Some have been along since the start and some like me have been along almost as long. That have naturally led to a core that "know" each other a bit better depending on how interactive they've been with others over the years.

Rui S
That's why I'm not a fan of the new "like" feature.

Urban Gardini
Yes, I was very surprised the other day when I all of a sudden had a like on my F-14 build. Didn't even know that the function had been implemented and I do remember that Tim was dead set against the function two years ago.

Rui S
Yap. just like faceF@§#$%& 👎

Slavo Hazucha
Urban & Rui - I see your point (I currently do not even have a working FB account, but I know how it works...), but I do not think it´s entirely a bad idea - I am not here all too long, but scrolling through stuff effectively every day and I try to write more than just a word or two when I post, explaining what I like etc... that´s quite time-consuming and after some initial enthusiasm, I effectively stopped commenting on tanks, ww2 aircraft, cars or god forbid bikes - putting myself into a "bubble within a bubble" around modern aircraft. Yet I do like many tanks & stuff I scroll through and giving them a simple "like" is now an option... just letting the guy who spend hours sweating over the bench working on a subject I do not know nearly enough s**t about to leave a proper comment that I simply like what I see surely is not that bad.

Provided, of course we´ll all de-evolve to just hitting the button & posting nothing... but I do not really see that... At least not with "my gift" for short message delivery... 😄

Urban Gardini
Yep, soulless clicking!

Rui S
@Slavo I also see your point. I always consider and praise your good & founded comments.
I never had FB and I sure don't intend to get it now or in the future.
What I don't like in a like botton it's precisely the fact that it fosters a simple click and a race for the album or whatever with the most likes, avoiding the efort of comenting. (Yes, sometimes it's not easy).
I started in a bubble as you say for scale 1/35, but in the contrary I'm now starting to coment more and more other scales when I've the time and until today i didn't use the like botton or I intend to do it.😉

Chaz Gordon
Slavo, I'm with your sentiment exactly

Patrick Hagelstein
I can only agree to all of the above. Always looking forward to reading a Slavo remark, but understanding how time consuming it may be to write something down to appreciate someone's efforts. If I'm within a certain bubble and if I really want to comment, help or support a mate, I'll definitely take the time to write a positive comment down. For things that are outside of my bubble, yet within my 'awe' spectrum, having a 👍 option comes in handy. I might hover over some discussions or albums before commenting, but I will always try to find time to let the builder know that a build is being appreciated. Sometimes with a remark, sometimes through a 👍.

Patrick Hagelstein
And now, time for Peter to throw something else than Zero onto this piece of plastic! 😉

Chaz Gordon
Have to say, In Peter's shoes, I'd be tempted to strip the first shell and treat it as a challenge.

Patrick Hagelstein
The general outlines are still intact.... Panel lines are still where they were. It could be a nice piece of plastic to toy with in front of the TV while puttying, sanding and rescribing it just to hone one's techniques.

Alexander Grivonev
Peter, when you wake up and see this: apologies for derailing your thread!😄

Cocerning the thumbs up, it is a fine addition for a quick acknowledgement of a build/album that caught your eye without the necessity or urgency to write a comment.

Rui S
Yap, just like ( Y ) => 👍 (and even this one i never use it alone).
or otherwise "i like it" but i will just give it a n.º and let it go down to oblivion…???
no interaction???
No, defenitly not for me😎

Slavo Hazucha
The fact the entire like button discussion happens right here is a testimony how much we like Peter's valorous effort! 😄

I still stand by my previous assessment, but give an inch back that if the amount of likes is a major sorting/filtering criteria that's not my coup of tea... I really appreciate the friendly, calm, generally non- competitive and positive atmosphere as-is. If the like is a bonus to give a mate a quick "seen it, liked it" confirm, I'm in, but not for any sort of e-scoring system...

Chaz Gordon
To get back to the melty paint, Bossy, I noticed your comment about pressure. Automotive paints are usually sprayed at pressures airbrush compressors cannot reach. I'd say this might explain the bumpy finish, it would also explain the "heat" of the paint.

Modern HVLP guns operate with an input pressure of 30PSI, Old School Siphon guns can be as high as 60PSI. plus they have a fan pattern aircap to further atomise those droplets.

I used to spray fast drying thin Primer coats at 60PSI, with a cheap gun, then after nibbing the Primer, I'd spray the Gloss as one mist one medium, wait for flash and one Heavy coat with slow thinner all at 45 PSI with the Devilbiss Siphon Gun.

At that pressure, everything but the heavy coat was dry in around the time it took to finish the length of the vehicle and come back for the next overlapping pass. as such, the solvent doesn't hang around long, until that last heavy coat, by which time it's got 5-6 coats of dry paint under it, at least 3 of which are cured.

Spanjaard
well, zero paints seem to recommend several very, very thin layers before getting anything heaver

Chaz Gordon
It would make sense, the thin coats would dry quickly and start to cure. even without curing, you can usually wipe down automotive paint with a rag damp (not soaked) with thinner not long after it is touch dry, but that fan cap definitely gets the drying process kick started.

Chaz Gordon
I'm surprised someone like Vallejo hasn't come up with a custom mixing system yet. There's only around 70 tints plus a handful of bases utilised to mix any matched automotive, aviation, standard or military colour you can think of. Micas and pearls are a little different, but that is mainly the base medium that is special. There's around 600 different colours in Vallejo's full range at the moment. Sure they could put something together

Kerry COX
The problem I see with ZERO paints and the many coats you have to apply is that the first and remaining coats never get a gloss look but the fine 'orange peel' effect, and no matter HOW many coats of clear you put over that dull finish, the OP will still be present and impossible to get rid of.
That is why I much more prefer to use Tamiya enamels, as the gloss is instant and dries rock hard.
To each his own I guess. 👍 😉

Peter Hardy
I will have another try with Zero on another project. I have some paint sets for other builds and rather see it as a challenge. I will have a try with the Tamiya enamels as they came with the kit. More strings to bows I suppose!

Patrick Hagelstein
Good luck, mate! 👍